In this week’s episode, host Tom Butta sits down with Cindy Davis, an independent Board Member at Airship, to discuss how there is still time to prepare for the future of marketing channels if you start today. Otherwise, your brand might wake up in five years without any real way to engage your customers.
In this week’s episode, host Tom Butta sits down with Cindy Davis, an independent Board Member at Airship, to discuss how there is still time to prepare for the future of marketing channels if you start today. Otherwise, your brand might wake up in five years without any real way to engage your customers.
Formerly an EVP at Walmart, Disney, L Brands and Chief Brand Officer at Bed Bath & Beyond, Cindy is she’s an experienced executive with a demonstrated history of driving results across the retail, hospitality and entertainment industries by building strong brands and customer relationships.
Tom asks why Cindy decided to join the Airship Board of Directors in September of 2022, and what advice she has for other women out there looking to serve on a board themselves one day. Additionally, you’ll hear key data regarding mobile retention numbers (hint: the average might be lower than you expect), what opportunities we now have post-2020, and Cindy’s thoughts on who internally should really be responsible for the mobile app.
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Guest Bio
Cindy Davis became an independent Board Member at Airship in 2022. Formerly an EVP at Walmart, Disney, L Brands and Chief Brand Officer at Bed Bath & Beyond, she’s an experienced executive with a demonstrated history of driving results across the retail, hospitality and entertainment industries by building strong brands and customer relationships.
Cindy has general management expertise with P&L responsibility, and is highly skilled in business strategy, brand management, eCommerce, digital marketing, customer engagement and more. She’s an influential leader, creative thinker, and developer of high-performing teams.
Cindy received her Masters in International Business Management from Thunderbird School of Global Management and a Bachelor of Business Administration and Accounting from William & Mary.
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Guest Quote
"I do believe that one of the things we've all got to work hard on is being able to measure and demonstrate the incremental value that comes from having an engaged customer within the app. Honestly, from a analytics perspective, when you think abouth ow much work we do on ROAS for every single channel in the marketing equation. But really being able to demonstrate the short term and the long term value of a customer that's really engaged in the app, I think is something we've still gotta work on.” – Cindy Davis
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Time Stamps
*(01:23) Cindy's Background
*(03:28) Why Cindy joined Airship as a Board Member
*(05:42) The challenges brands face in going mobile
*(08:57) A world without developers
*(11:28) Shopping in a world after 2020
*(14:45) Who should own the app from a brand perspective?
*(18:18) What does the latest mobile retention data show?
*(19:07) What Cindy would have done differently
*(21:54) Advice from Cindy
*(27:34) Advice for women who want to serve on boards
*(29:27) Rapid Fire Questions
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Links
[00:00:00] Cindy Davis: We've all worked with traditional marketing channels so long that we know down to the dollar how much revenue we're gonna get by doing that last email campaign. But if we keep spinning in that cycle where we're just watching traditional channels like email get less and less and less effective, you're gonna wake up in five years and find ourselves without a way to really engage customers.
[00:00:30] Cindy Davis: It's scary, but you gotta leave the comfortable channels that are losing effectiveness behind, or at least be prepared to use them as a compliment to what you're trying to do within the app.
[00:00:43] Producer: Welcome to Masters of Max, a mobile app Experience podcast. Please welcome your host, Tom Butta, chief Strategy and Marketing Officer at airship.
[00:00:56] Tom Butta: Welcome to another episode of Masters of Max. Today I have the extreme pleasure of speaking with Cindy Davis. Cindy Davis is an esteemed brand and marketing executive. Having worked across a number of industries and for many, many leading companies. I also have the pleasure of working with Cindy on a regular basis now that Cindy is a board member of of Airship.
[00:01:19] Tom Butta: So Cindy, welcome to the show. Thanks,
Tom.
[00:01:22] Cindy Davis: Good to be here.
[00:01:23] Tom Butta: Perhaps in your own words, maybe you could tell us a a little bit about your experiences over, over the years.
[00:01:29] Cindy Davis: Sure. Too many years, but, um, I'll be happy to give you the sort of Cliff note version. You know Tom, I've been blessed to work with some great companies, pizza, Hutt, Starwood, and Hilton Hotels, A pivot to retail with Walmart.
[00:01:45] Cindy Davis: Disney and, and even Victoria's Secrets. So I've, you know, I've had the good fortune of, um, working across a number of different industries. The common thread for me in my career has really been, it's all about building businesses, building brands, and building loyal and profitable customer relationships.
[00:02:04] Cindy Davis: It's what gave me energy. It's what kept me doing this crazy job all these years. But I've thoroughly, thoroughly enjoyed it. Now obviously having a chance to, to work with you and the team at Airship as a board member is a great way to contribute my experience in a whole nother
[00:02:20] Tom Butta: way. I. So you mentioned three different things.
[00:02:22] Tom Butta: You mentioned, you know, building brand, you mentioned building businesses, and you mentioned driving loyal customers. Is there a order or a progression to that or is it just three sides of the triangle?
[00:02:33] Cindy Davis: No, it's almo. I think it's almost backwards, probably, right? Um, the building, the business is the outcome, right, of really understanding the essence of a brand and what value it has and what benefits it can deliver.
[00:02:49] Cindy Davis: Truly understanding your customers, right? What their wants and needs are, what their behavior are, and be really the best way to bring those two things together.
[00:02:59] Tom Butta: That's great. I'm, I'm glad, I'm glad we dug in a little bit there because I have the same view. The outcome is the business, right. So, and obviously you've had a lot of success doing that, so it is a pleasure to have you as a, as a board member of Airship after a fateful conversation on a flight from Denver to to Jacksonville, Florida where we first met.
[00:03:18] Tom Butta: Really, besides the fact that you had jealousy ar around the fact that I had brought my meal on board and you were, you were suffering from the really bad food that they put in front of you. What was interesting to you about airship and why ultimately did you choose to be a board
[00:03:32] Cindy Davis: member? Yeah, I'm glad.
[00:03:33] Cindy Davis: I'm glad we met and glad you took the time to introduce me to Airship. I was on a journey really to sort of build out a board portfolio where I believed, My background could be of real value in accelerating growth for companies that I chose to serve with and to join. And you know, I had already in my mind decided, I really wanted to serve on a board of a company that was helping marketers, you know, grow their businesses and really be part of the future.
[00:04:09] Cindy Davis: I've been doing this for a while and marketing is evolving so quickly that I really knew if I was going to stay current and stay engaged. It was gonna have to be with a company that really helped marketers fully leverage the mobile app. I mean, that is the future, and that is the way to build intimate customer relationships.
[00:04:28] Cindy Davis: And so when you introduced me to Airship and I began to learn more and more about the company from you and from Brett and the other members of the board, I just knew this was a place where I could really, um, continue to learn, which is one of the reasons I'm doing board work, you know, in the first place, um, where I could make a contribution and also get to work with some really smart people.
[00:04:46] Cindy Davis: Well,
[00:04:47] Tom Butta: we're really glad to have you and it's also been great how much you've dug in and, you know, attending our customer advisory board meetings. And I'm being really curious about, about all the things that we're doing. Certainly been hugely valuable to me and to the team. What's interesting is you said that you wanted to be involved in the future and where things were going, and yet we're talking about the mobile app.
[00:05:09] Tom Butta: The mobile app, something that's been around for a while, and yet we're still talking about it as it's actually the place that. That brands need to be, I mean, why do you think we're still talking about it as the future and as if the future hasn't already really arrived. Is it just because many of brands haven't fully adopted it, ma Is it because there's operational challenges perhaps, and how teams work together?
[00:05:35] Tom Butta: I mean, what, what do you think is, is causing it to still be something that is a huge opportunity in the future? I.
[00:05:42] Cindy Davis: Yeah, I think there are at least three reasons why, you know, one is definitely there are still companies today that don't realize, right, what they're missing out on in terms of driving customer value by engaging customers in the app.
[00:05:55] Cindy Davis: Right. I was part of a conversation. I. Less than a year ago with a company that I was advising who was building their loyalty program and enhancing their loyalty program. And we actually had a debate about whether or not they should make it a requirement for people to download the app to be part of the loyalty program.
[00:06:16] Cindy Davis: I mean, literally that we were even having that conversation was a surprise to me, but I think it's sort of indicative that there are still companies out there that aren't fully embracing the app and don't think they're customers. We'll fully embrace the app, which is kind of hard to believe. You mentioned operational.
[00:06:32] Cindy Davis: You know, look, that's one of the biggest barriers, right? If you ask somebody, any marketer, if they believe they should be doing a better job engaging their customers within the app, and that's where they can really grow the value and intimacy of the relationship with that customer, they'll all say yes, but then the reality hits, right, which is.
[00:06:54] Cindy Davis: Well, now I have to get in line behind every other priority of the e-commerce team and the digital team and try to eke out some development time to help me make it a reality. I know that for a fact, and the customers and the companies I worked with. We didn't know about a company like Airship. Um, just beholden to, in a really hard way, limited developer development resources, and we really couldn't take advantage of the opportunities.
[00:07:23] Cindy Davis: That's all changed, but I think there's still companies out there fighting that fight. The third challenge for most marketers in terms of investing more and spending more time and resource on the app is, I don't think most CEOs understand. The value. And I do believe that one of the things that we've all got to work hard on is being able to, you know, measure and demonstrate the incremental value that comes from having, you know, an engaged customer within the app.
[00:07:55] Cindy Davis: And I, I still think we've got a lot of work to do there. Honestly, from an analytics perspective, when you think about. You know how much work we do on roas, every single channel, you know, in the marketing equation. But really being able to demonstrate the short-term and the long-term value of a customer that's really engaged in the app, I think is something we've still gotta work on.
[00:08:16] Cindy Davis: Yeah.
[00:08:16] Tom Butta: It's one thing to point to. Earnings calls from the likes of, I don't know, home Depot or Nike or American Eagle or others who are saying, wow, our UP customers are actually. Worth three to four times the all of our other customers, and they tend to buy two to three times more across the year than our non-op customers.
[00:08:36] Tom Butta: But it's another thing to actually prove it out.
[00:08:38] Cindy Davis: Right? Well, especially to A C F O, right? Yeah, a hundred percent takes a lot more evidence, um, particularly when. We're challenged with, you know, marketing budgets being, you know, being really lean and you know, real financial decisions being made about where we devote the next dollar.
[00:08:57] Tom Butta: What do you think would happen if, I don't know, call it the non-technical teams, marketers, product managers, app teams? What do you think would happen if those non-technical people didn't have to rely on developers to actually get things done in real time? In the moments that matter for us as consumers?
[00:09:15] Tom Butta: When you're engaged in the app and you know, they see something that they know they should adjust to make the experience better, what would happen?
[00:09:22] Cindy Davis: Um, well, I know that the experience for the customer would change for sure. I can give you one quick example. The last company I worked with, we knew for a fact that we were leaving money on the table.
[00:09:34] Cindy Davis: We had customers coming shopping the store, and 36% of them were leaving without finding what they looked for. So we know we've got a huge, the majority of our customers shop in the store and 36% of them are leaving without finding what they were looking for when they came to the store. But all the development resources were focused on optimizing e-comm sales period.
[00:09:56] Cindy Davis: And all we wanted to do was make it possible for the app to be the G P s for the customer in store and the relative impact. Of improving e-commerce a little bit within the app, or making it possible for the customer to navigate the store in the app and find what they're looking for. I mean, it was dwarfed, right?
[00:10:17] Cindy Davis: I mean, so much more value, right? With making that app, really a G P S for the store, but we couldn't get it done. I mean, so just imagine the difference there for that one company and that one, you know, feature. I mean, it would've been a huge difference in the bottom line. I might have saved that company from bankruptcy,
[00:10:35] Tom Butta: honestly.
[00:10:36] Tom Butta: So that's a great example. And the one company that I'm fully aware of that, that actually has like quite literally made the app A A G P Ss vehicle for navigating what's in the store has been Home Depot. I mean, just look at their, their advertising. They are literally advertising what the experiences through the lens of the app before the customer makes the trip to the store is in the parking lot, is in the store.
[00:11:02] Tom Butta: And, um, it's been a huge, you know, navi navigational guide, if
[00:11:05] Cindy Davis: you will. Absolutely. I mean, for a big box retailer with hundreds of thousands of SKUs, right? I mean, half the challenge is just making sure customers know what you have to offer and where they can find it, and where they can find it fast.
[00:11:19] Tom Butta: Yeah.
[00:11:19] Tom Butta: And then get
[00:11:20] Cindy Davis: outta the store quickly, then outta store, you know, quickly with Scan and go Right. Or all the other, you know, um, tools that we now have to tap into. You know, it's, it's funny during Covid, you know, I mean, what a horrible experience for our country and, and for individuals and families. But, you know, one of the things that happened during Covid was, you know, brick and mortar retailers got lots and lots and lots and lots and lots of online shoppers.
[00:11:48] Cindy Davis: People that never shop with them online, you know, and it's a huge opportunity for brands, but it's, it's just demonstrated the challenge, right? Because now you know, I'm used to shopping with you online and it's super easy and it's streamlined and it's easy for me to find what I'm looking for. Now I walk into a physical store and frankly, I'm kind of bummed, right?
[00:12:09] Cindy Davis: It's just hard. It's hard to find what you're looking for. It's hard to find my size. I mean, all of that can be overcome. With, with an app, with some pretty simple features and you know somebody that's paying attention to the customer journey.
[00:12:24] Tom Butta: It's really interesting because you're talking about a significant disconnect between life, you know, in the app and then life in the store, and you've authenticated yourself in the app.
[00:12:36] Tom Butta: You've probably already established your preferences, not just for how you communicate, but the kinds of things that you're interested in. You have probably some purchase history. You may even have a wishlist. So there's an awful lot of quote, personalized, I don't know, desires and history that a brand knows about you and can help guide towards, you know, what's next, potentially.
[00:13:01] Tom Butta: But then you go into the store, no one knows who you are other than you saying what you're looking for. They don't know. They have to ask questions when in fact, The app is becoming that navigational guide, if you will, for a shopping experience in a physical location. That's, that's actually really, really interesting.
[00:13:22] Tom Butta: Yeah.
[00:13:22] Cindy Davis: I think it's gonna be one of the biggest challenges for brick and mortar retailers. It's just finding a way. Um, I mean, I think of, you know, a customer standing in the middle of, well, a Home Depot or a Sam's Club, right. Like giant place, right? I have a list. I know what I'm looking for, I just don't know where to find it.
[00:13:44] Cindy Davis: Or I don't know where the, you know, gluten-free items are, or I don't know where I can find the best snack for, you know, my kid who needs sugar free accounting on a store associate to be the person that actually guides you, I mean, That's just not gonna happen. Even before the labor shortage we had today, it was hard enough to get trained associates to help customers and people wanna be able to do it themselves.
[00:14:12] Cindy Davis: So just make it possible for me on the app and you know, I'll, I'll shop you in store and online.
[00:14:18] Tom Butta: Yep. Yep, yep, yep. So being able to really meld that in-store experience with the same experience that's in the app, um, could be a breakthrough. I totally, especially for the big box retailers. Yeah, definitely.
[00:14:31] Tom Butta: So we talked about CFOs continually need to, you know, be shown why is this worthy of, of an investment of our resources? And then you also talked about the barrier of relying on development, scarce development resources. Ultimately, who is it that in your view, that should be the person making the case for investing in a value creation playbook called the mobile app customer?
[00:14:57] Tom Butta: Who do you think should be in charge? You
[00:14:59] Cindy Davis: could. So it's interesting that you say that. 'cause first, that's probably one of the biggest debates, right? I mean, one of the biggest challenges, um, today, um, within companies, and I've faced it, you know, several times in different organizations, I have a bias, right?
[00:15:14] Cindy Davis: Because I believe the chief marketing officer is also the Chief Revenue Officer and the Chief Customer experience officer and the chief growth officer. And so I do believe it's the job of the marketer, the chief marketing officer. Not necessarily to dictate, but to bring together their peers in other areas and align on goals that are cross-functional and cross channel.
[00:15:41] Cindy Davis: Starting with like what's our overall customer strategy, right? Because that's the only way, I mean, it's hard in retail, but think about it, Tom, in travel, right? You've got the people in, you know, the airline, the hotel business that are. Responsible for driving revenue through booking flights, right? They just want somebody to like, you know, you know, finish that transaction, finish that transaction, but the real customer loyalty gets built.
[00:16:08] Cindy Davis: Right? Not with the transaction, but with the experience. Right. I know how much you travel, and I do too. And you know, the airlines and hotels I'm most loyal to are the ones that. Allow me to be engaged through the app and are communicating with me real time in a way that helps me navigate that experience.
[00:16:30] Cindy Davis: But within that organization, I can't imagine the battles and debates that are happening, right? I mean, 'cause there still are limited resources, right? But if you're one of those people that thinks you know that that customer experience ends with a transaction, right? You're not gonna be able to hold onto those customers.
[00:16:47] Tom Butta: Or even worse, that somebody simply downloading the app, which has been the goal of, I don't know, advertisers, to get people to take an action. They took the action of downloading the app that that's the
[00:16:59] Cindy Davis: end state. Yeah. You know, that's one of the first things I learned through Airship, that if I would rewind and go back to my time as a chief marketing officer would've probably changed.
[00:17:11] Cindy Davis: I know. Would've changed the way we approached. Not only the marketing dollar allocation, right, but the times and resources, right? I mean, you guys were the ones that helped me realize what 25% of people who download the app are gonna leave within 30 days. I mean, that's insane. Think about how much money and time and effort, I mean, I remember being on earnings calls, right?
[00:17:34] Cindy Davis: Being very proud of how many people we had gotten to download the app. And nobody asked the next question, right? Which would've been right. How many monthly active users do you have today, Cindy? I mean, that would've been the real question, but again, it comes back to, it's one thing to know that it's another thing to have the resources right, and the ability to be able to act on it because.
[00:17:57] Cindy Davis: How I, you know, continue to engage you in the app. It might be very different than how I want to be engaged. I can't have a one size fits all approach. It's gotta be able to be personalized to my particular needs. You know, at least, you know, segmented based on, you know, what you're looking for and what I'm looking for from the app experience with that brand.
[00:18:18] Tom Butta: Yep. You were quoting some data before just to tell you what the latest data is, so, On average across all industries, it's actually less than 10% of people who download remain a customer after 7, 14, 30 days. The best performers of all the airship companies in each vertical, of which we work across a number of them, 10, to do two to four times better than the average.
[00:18:48] Tom Butta: The average is typically under 10%.
[00:18:50] Cindy Davis: Maybe that's a little piece of paper we should slide to the C F O. Somebody's gotta start asking the question, right? Of all that resource and time and effort you spent to get people to download, what are you doing to engage them? It's one of the questions I ask in the board room and with companies that I'm advising.
[00:19:07] Tom Butta: So you, you started to answer my next question by virtue of the conversation we just had. And the question is, if you knew then what you know now, you know, how, how would you perhaps do things differently? I mean, as someone who is in charge of building a brand and engaging in enrolling customers such that they become loyal customers that ultimately manifest itself in more business.
[00:19:31] Tom Butta: You know, what might you do differently based on what you know
[00:19:35] Cindy Davis: now? Yeah, I mean, Hindsight's 2020, but the, the, you know, what my goal would be would be to, to convince my team and my peers that we should make the app, the center of the customer experience, right. And sort of drive from there. I think we were most successful in doing that.
[00:19:56] Cindy Davis: Tom, when I was at Sam's Club, I mean, it's hard to think back. Just less than 10 years. There was no such thing as an app. In the club channel. I mean, for that matter, Walmart didn't have an app then. I mean, you know, we think about it, it wasn't part of the way we thought about the tools we had in our arsenal to be able to engage customers.
[00:20:16] Cindy Davis: The reason we were able to get it done at Sam's Club was because member retention was everything. The club channel, you know, 65, 70% of your. Your income comes from membership fees. And so you have, I mean, literally every member you retain at the end of their first, you know, membership year is critical.
[00:20:37] Cindy Davis: And so we were able to get an app created and get the resources to do it, you know, outside the company at the time because member retention was important. So if, if you just said that, and you said for any company where customer retention is critical of their financial success, Start with the app. That should be the place you're starting from an investment perspective.
[00:21:01] Cindy Davis: 'cause that's where you can create the most intimate possible relationship with that customer. But that is not the way we thought about it. You know, when I was engaged and leading marketing with most of those companies, and I. I mean, I, I know it's easier, right? Right. We've had other ways of engaging customers, you know, other channels, but it's nothing like what we can do now.
[00:21:24] Cindy Davis: And I think that's what I would do different. I would ask my marketing team to start with what are we doing to engage people within the app?
[00:21:32] Tom Butta: Yep. Treating the app as the center, the digital center of customer experience,
[00:21:36] Cindy Davis: and I wouldn't even say just digital, I'd say the center, and I'm clear about that because of the conversation we had about.
[00:21:44] Cindy Davis: The cross channel. I mean, in my mind, the app is just as important to the physical experience that a customer has with you, as it is with the, for the digital experience they have for you.
[00:21:54] Tom Butta: Yeah. Why don't we maybe shift a little bit and, you know, talk in a, in a segment that I might headline as advice. So, you know, the benefit of having.
[00:22:04] Tom Butta: Had such an illustrious career as yours is that you've gained a lot of experience and thankfully you're an individual who is continuously learning, but also always willing to share. And so I would ask, what advice would you give to, let's just say you meet a CMO at an event, perhaps even at one of the companies you used to work for, or a company related to one of them.
[00:22:28] Tom Butta: What advice would you, would you give them in terms of. Preparing themselves to be as successful as possible. That's
[00:22:36] Cindy Davis: a big question. That's a giant one. Yeah. Um, I mean, a couple of things. I mean, first, and, and we talked a little bit about it and, and as I talk to marketers today, particularly people that I've worked with in the past, first thing I say is don't squander the silver lining, you know, from the pandemic.
[00:22:56] Cindy Davis: Really lean into those cross-channel, omni-channel relationships with customers. Second, probably take a a really hard look at not only the. Marketing channels you're using today, but think about where you and the company need to be in five years. Right. Where do you need to be as a marketing team to help your company be successful?
[00:23:24] Cindy Davis: You know, it's hard. We've all worked with traditional marketing channels so long, right? That we know down to the dollar how much revenue we're gonna get by doing that last email campaign. Right. If we keep spinning in that cycle where we're just watching traditional channels like email get less and less and less effective, you're gonna wake up in five years and find ourselves without a way to really engage customers.
[00:23:54] Cindy Davis: So I think I'd say ask yourself where you wanna be in five years and start your path to get there. Now, luckily for your clients at Airship, they have a partner to help, but. Leaning into the mobile app as the center of the customer experience, even today, instead of being prepared to migrate there, I think is really important.
[00:24:18] Cindy Davis: It's scary. I mean, they're sitting in front of the same tough CFOs I sat in front of, right? Who's really asking a lot of hard questions about what is that going to be worth? But you gotta leave the comfortable channels that are losing effectiveness. Behind, or at least be prepared to use them as a compliment to what you're trying to do within the app.
[00:24:40] Tom Butta: Yeah, I love that idea of, um, thinking five years out, I, I worked for A C F O who had, who always talked about, you know, start with the end in mind and then work backwards and, and, and I think that that's the same idea and it makes complete sense. What's the best advice you've ever been given?
[00:24:58] Cindy Davis: Oh gosh. Um, I get lots of it 'cause I asked for it.
[00:25:01] Cindy Davis: Um, that's one thing I learned early in my career. I'll tell you one. I had a, uh, former boss now continues to be a mentor of mine years and years and years later, who said To succeed and grow, you have to have both champions and challengers in your personal board of directors, right? I mean, the people that you rely on.
[00:25:21] Cindy Davis: Most people when they seek out mentors or they seek out advice, seek out champions. The people that think very highly of you and will support you and promote you and bring your name up when there's a new opportunity, but he was really adamant that you grow more. When you have challengers in your corner, people that can really be your toughest critics, people that can push you out of your comfort zone, by the way, he did that, right?
[00:25:52] Cindy Davis: This is a guy that when I finished a presentation on the elevator, on the way outta the building would give me a grade, right? And it was never an a, I can just tell you that. Um, but I, it caused me to really think differently. About how I like really tried to get feedback in my career when I worked for Walmart.
[00:26:13] Cindy Davis: You know, people were generally pretty nice in that environment and so I would ask people like, what'd you think of that presentation? And they would say, oh, you did a great job, Cindy. You are really good communicator. Like, Tom that didn't help us, that didn't help me get better. Right? Um, so I was really, I listened to him and got much more deliberate about asking, I would ask the same question, but I'd say, what three things could I have done better in that meeting or in that presentation?
[00:26:40] Cindy Davis: And I'd ask them that in advance. Um, so they'd be listening for it. And you, I got loads and loads of great input.
[00:26:49] Tom Butta: So before you delivered your presentation, you had said, As you listen to this, I'd love for you to think about what I could be doing better. Yeah, interesting. That's great advice. I think, you know, as you know, the old adage is, you know, you learn more from your losses than you do from your wins.
[00:27:05] Tom Butta: Certainly as a competitive athlete, that was certainly the case for me. So, um, the other question I have for you has to do with, it's an area that you seem to be, you know, passionate about and, and when I said always willing to help, I think this is an area where you are willing to help. And that is, you know, what advice would you have for women executives who wanna serve on boards?
[00:27:26] Tom Butta: You went through a process yourself ultimately, and it could be that they're relatively young in their careers or, you know, in the middle of their careers, but they're, they have an ambition out there.
[00:27:36] Cindy Davis: That's a good question. I believe in pay it forward, and I've always taken time to mentor other women leaders.
[00:27:42] Cindy Davis: It's something that gives me joy. So I continue to do it in the board journey first. It's a real, it's a good time. Right boards are getting serious about diversity in the boardroom and, um, saw some numbers last week. Um, 74% of the new directors in 2022 were from underrepresented groups. Almost half of the new directors in 2022 were women.
[00:28:08] Cindy Davis: So the good news is it's a good time. That isn't true everywhere, but a lot of companies are thinking seriously and really recognizing the impact that having diverse voices around the table, functionally, gender-wise, ethnicity can make in terms of a company's success. So that's, that's first. That's the good news.
[00:28:26] Cindy Davis: The watch out is as a result, I've had conversations with companies. Where no matter how hard I asked the questions or how many people I talked to about a board opportunity, it was clear that they were checking in diversity box. Right. And that's not why I do this, right? I do this because I wanna make a contribution.
[00:28:50] Cindy Davis: I wanna be able to help you and the airship team and your clients succeed. I don't mind being the only woman in the room, right? I mean, I've had those situations most of my career, particularly in senior, in senior officer roles. But I don't wanna only be in the room because I'm a woman. I wanna be there because I have a contribution to make.
[00:29:10] Cindy Davis: We could spend an hour talking about this. I just did a panel last month about the road to the boardroom and and what I've learned. So any of your listeners wanna reach out to me. I'm happy to spend more time with the tough lessons I've learned along the way so far. Yeah.
[00:29:25] Tom Butta: Ultimately, that's the root of my question.
[00:29:27] Tom Butta: So we're just at the end of the segment now, which are these kind of rapid fire questions, which will only take a couple of minutes, so, okay. Android
[00:29:35] Cindy Davis: or iPhone? iPhone. It changed my life.
[00:29:38] Tom Butta: Wow, that's big. Oh yeah. Oh yeah. Okay. What's the one app you can't live without?
[00:29:42] Cindy Davis: Hmm. Can anybody really get it to one? Um, okay.
[00:29:47] Cindy Davis: Okay. One or two or three, no, on a daily basis. You, you know me too well on a daily basis it's Starbucks. Um, and I have enjoyed so much. Getting to know some of the Starbucks folks, but right now, right this moment, it's an app called Zazzle. Zazzle is an online platform for customized products, and that includes everything from invitations, you know, to custom pinging pong paddles and everything in between.
[00:30:18] Cindy Davis: And my son's getting married in August. And so I am literally on the Zazzle app, you know, multiple times a day, you know, doing rehearsal dinner invitations and you know, I mean, everything that you need. Um, and so it won't, it's not my daily app like Starbucks, but it's the one I'm on probably most of the time right now.
[00:30:38] Tom Butta: So it's truly helping your life get better. Absolutely. Absolutely. Um, are there any, I don't know, new apps? Features or even mobile trends or just overarching trends that you are currently, you know, really enjoying or, or, or fascinated by? Yeah.
[00:30:57] Cindy Davis: You know what? I'll, um, and it's tied to something we talked about before, I think, you know, Think about during the pandemic.
[00:31:05] Cindy Davis: You know, again, good news is a lot of people only shopped in stores, shopped online, and got used to all that convenience, you know, that you could get from shopping online. The flip side to that is online shopping. For most companies, that engagement isn't very inspiring, right? It's engineered to be.
[00:31:31] Cindy Davis: Frictionless and you know, the shortest, you know, route to getting the products you want and getting 'em to delivered now. And so I'm really interested in seeing. What marketers can now do within the app to really inspire people and help them discover. Um, and, you know, um, I mentioned Zazzle. That is one of the coolest thing about the redesign of their app that they did.
[00:31:57] Cindy Davis: When you go to, when I go on their app, now I have the choice, right? I can shop or I can explore if I know what I'm looking for, if I'm reordering some invitations. They have this most streamlined, most convenient, fastest way for me to do that. But if I don't really know, then I can go to the explore, um, element within their app and they serve up content to inspire me from designers that I might be interested in, based on my past behavior.
[00:32:24] Cindy Davis: So it's sort of a, a curated, you know, browsing experience for me. And I think that's, you know, I think we've got more companies that need to do the same. Let me raise my hand and say why I am here. Why am I in the app right this moment and give me the options to go where it meets my needs at this particular moment.
[00:32:44] Tom Butta: Yeah. I wanna browse and discover, or I just need to get this done. Exactly right. That's fascinating. Yeah, I think that's, that's really cool. Okay. I know you live in a vacation spot, but, but perhaps besides where you live, uh, where's your vacation? Favorite vacation place? Yeah, living
[00:33:02] Cindy Davis: on a beach, um, is my, is my favorite, you know, like, for sure.
[00:33:07] Cindy Davis: For sure. Um, look, at the end of the day, the beach is my happy place. You know, it's the one place where I reenergize and relax at the same time. And, I can't do that many places. So any vacation spot where there is a relaxing beach and ideally I'm there with my family and my friends. So, um, and a frozen margarita to boot.
[00:33:33] Tom Butta: That's cool. Um, that sounds like a great trip. Cindy, thank you very, very much. It's, uh, it's always a pleasure to be in your company and thank you for sharing, uh, all the wonderful thoughts you have. I'm sure our, our listeners are gonna get
[00:33:44] Cindy Davis: great value outta it. Terrific, Tom, happy to do it. Look forward to seeing you again soon.
[00:33:48] Cindy Davis: Thanks.
[00:33:50] Producer: Thank you for listening to Masters of Max, a mobile app experience podcast, brought to you by the team at airship. Find out more about how you can help your brand deliver better, more personalized app experiences@airship.com. If you enjoyed today's episode, please take a moment to subscribe and rate the show.
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